Thoughts on the allegory of Adam and Eve and the Fall

Disclaimer: I don't know anything and I already know that.


When God said, "Don't eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil," what he really said was, "Don't choose fear.".

The fallen one tried to get Adam to fear, but Adam wouldn't listen, so the fallen one tried to get Eve to fear. He found a way in, and Eve shared that fear with Adam. Perhaps she started a fight with him.

Then God returned and they couldn't bear to be in his presence because they had partaken of fear and anger. That made the Light and Love impossible to bear, so they had to leave to continue to exist.

And their children were born to parents who had learned to fear, and who had learned to be angry. And the fallen ones capitalized on that to create as much pain and mayhem and fear as they could get away with in all of the generations since Eva and Adam.

As far as the first clothing goes, I've heard the theory that Eve and Adam were clothed in Light until they "ate the fruit" - then that Light left and they had no covering to protect them, so God made clothing that would work in a pinch, but wasn't as good as what they had before.

Why, then, do the scriptures say the man and the woman were naked but not ashamed? Maybe because they didn't wear clothing like we do, but were clothed in Light.

What about Eve/the scriptures saying Adam and Eve would have had no children? It's possible they were in training and, at some point, the Gods would have taught them how to combat fear with love, then they would have gone prepared to the dark spot in the garden (see below).

Why were fallen ones allowed to roam the garden? I'm sure I do not know . . . but what if they were only confined to one area? What if they were confined to the spooky old house and yard in a certain part of the garden that was majorly creepy to anyone who knew what fear was? What if the Gods said to stay away from that creepy place? (After all, the fallen ones were kicked out onto the same planet. Maybe they demanded a place next to Adam and Eve's house. Far enough away to not overpower them unawares, but close enough to entice them because . . . well, I guess life is about choices. And, besides that, this planet was their turf.)

Adam wasn't interested in the spooky old house, but EVe wondered what it was, so crossed over the boundaries to explore it. In that case, the fallen ones had a chance to put fear and anger into her heart and mind.

And, since it's an allegory, what if the Gods were Eve and Adam's parents (two couples) who had survived a global disaster, and had reached a spiritual level so high that they were, in reality, Gods?

Just wondering. It makes for an interesting story, to be sure.

Final Post About the Guide

I received a very good forwarded email in which the scripture committee explained more about the Guiding Principles. This was my reply to the friend who forwarded it to me: 

I am fully willing to accept the original. I wish we had been told, plainly, from the beginning that it was an assignment from the Lord to the committee.

I am also willing to accept the one that got 91% of the votes.

I have been willing to accept over and over again. Finally, I was prompted to back off and let the others fight it out. God knows my willingness to accept even something I view as imperfect. I think our repentance will not be complete unless we accept the original document, but I do not see that happening unless a major miracle occurs.

I posted my pleas on my blog and now I have stepped back. I am powerless to stop the confusion or to make anyone calm down enough (be fearless enough) to trust God enough to accept what we already have. The mass of confusion seems to be based on, "Me! Me! Choose mine! I will stop the process. I will put a cog in the works and prevent mutual agreement by my interpretation of the term "mutual agreement" and/or by my insistance that if you don't choose ME, I will refuse to cooperate, and thus keep a Guide from happening until we start being raped, murdered, robbed, and destroyed like those in Nauvoo." 

Yet we forget that by the current definition of mutual consent, God failed, for 1/3 of the hosts of heaven did not consent. Yet, the plan was still implemented, by the mutual consent of those who DID consent.

Our Compassionate God

Recently, I was staying in a hotel in Boise, Idaho with a friend. Our room was directly across from the guests' laundry room. On one side of our room were the stairs. On the other was the room of the ladies who had given me a ride to Boise. Sunday morning, my friend left to go home (had pressing business that prevented her from staying the full weekend). That afternoon, the ladies and I were going to meet some people for lunch.

I was in my room, pretty much killing time, when I heard what seemed like a year old baby throwing a fit. I didn't hear adults and supposed they were ignoring the child. A few minutes later, I opened my door to go out and right next to the door, pressed into it, was a two year old toddler, screaming and crying hysterically. I glanced into the laundry room as I picked her up. It was empty. I had felt incredible compassion for the child the moment I'd opened the door, and I told her, "We'll find your mom." She stopped being hysterical, but was still upset. I knocked on the ladies' door, and when I did, the toddler calmed down even more. When the door was opened, I explained what had happened and that I was going to take the child to the office (front desk) to see if they could find her mom. The ladies went with me downstairs and, on the elevator ride, one of them coaxed out of the child that she was two years old (she never spoke the whole time she was with us).

When we got to the front desk, I explained what had happened, and told them it was on the second floor. One of the ladies behind the desk came around and held her arms out to the child. The child hesitated for a nano-second. You could see her deciding if she could trust this person. Then she leaned over and reached out to the lady.

After we got back from lunch, we inquired at the front desk. Was the mom found? The man there had just begun his shift not long before. He said he had not seen the child, but had heard others talking about the incident, and, yes, the mom had been found.

Later that evening, I was talking to God, and he told me, "The child is a sign to you." He told me that the compassion I'd felt for the child was the same compassion he felt for me when I was hysterically scream-crying out to him because of being homeless (or threatened with it), not having enough food to eat, worried about other problems, or just plain having a freak-out attack for no reason that I knew of. He also let me know that just as I had taken immediate steps to solve the toddler's problem when I realized what was happening, so he, also, took steps to alleviate my suffering when I was freaking out.

I am sharing this experience because he told me to. He told me that this compassion he feels toward me is the same compassion he feels toward everyone. Our sincere prayers are always heard, even if we don't see immediate results.

Numbers

It seems to me that God likes 40, 7, and 3 ½. It also seems like God likes to use his messengers as signs to the people (see the Old Testament). He also likes to use heavenly bodies as signs (see Genesis).

I'll jump right into my thoughts. Denver Snuffer was baptized on Sept 10, 1973 (Second Comforter: Conversing with the Lord Through the Veil, page 88). 40 years later, to the day, he was excommunicated (see Lecture 1 in Boise, Idaho, of the 10-lecture circuit that stretched from Sept 2013 to Sept 2014).

His ministry began March 1, 1984 (Second Comforter, pages 104, 200-01). Interesting, I think: 1984. The name of a book about total loss of real freedom to act and be. A story about a man who tried to buck the system. I believe his ministry will either end or change 40 years later. On the exact day of March 1st, 2024? I don't have an opinion on that, though I do think it will be in the spring of that year.

And the moon shall turn to blood

When the moon is eclipsed, it looks blood red. No biggie, except there have been several blood moons on or near Jewish holy days, and even an LDS holy day (Saturday General Conference, April 4, 2015). You can read more about the eclipses and the holy days here and here. And here is a list of all the posts on Bare Record that talk about moon and blood, if you care to peruse it.

From the first link:

. . . the fact that these four blood moons will occur on significant Jewish holy days is not only rare, but significant. The first blood moon will be on Passover on April 15, 2014. There will be another blood moon on the following year on Passover which will be April 4, 2015. The other Jewish Holy Day is the Feast of Tabernacles which is  Oct. 8, 2014. On this day as well, there will be a Blood Moon Eclipse.. and then the following Feast of Tabernacle on Sept. 28, 2015 will be the 4th Blood Moon.

 The sun shall be turned to darkness

There's something interesting about the full eclipse of the sun (August 21, 2017) that goes from the west coast to the east coast of the continental United States. First, it falls on the birthday of "the venerable leader" of the LDS Church. Second, it is the first stroke of an X. The second stroke will come on April 8, 2024 and will begin in Mexico and end in a tiny bit of Canada, crossing the United States in the process.

As you can see below, it marks a giant X over the continental United States (as an aside, God's handwriting is very artistic. The X is not a straight, austere duet of lines but poetic curves). It's as if God will be saying, "I've had enough of your wickedness, rebellion, and nonsense, dearest Gentiles. I'm done. You are no longer a nation. The Gentiles have proven themselves fruit worthy only to be cast out and burned." I suspect it's all quickly downhill from there for us.

Sidenote: It was made known in a conference in St. George, Utah in March 2017 that God was offering another covenant. People will have the opportunity to accept or reject that covenant on Sept 3, 2017. The words of that covenant were given by the Lord in, if I remember correctly, July 2017, and 7 years from that conference is March 2024. Also, 7 years from verbally accepting or rejecting that covenant is Sept 2024.

Spring 2024.  
Denver's 40-year mission is complete. March 1. 
 The X is complete. April 8. 
The covenant is either accepted or rejected by our behavior; the time possibly past, and the country erupts into violence, the like of which has never been seen before. March to Sept.

It will be interesting to see how it all plays out. Maybe, just maybe, this post is not the vain musings of a religious lunatic. I wonder if we should, perhaps, "fear and tremble" and look into our own hearts for pride and rebellion against God, look into our own hearts to see if they are filled with love or with anger/accusation against our fellow beings. Truly, the earth is quickly filling with more violence than it has experienced for a long time. Not too many years from now, I expect, until the whole face of this land is one continual round of murder and bloodshed (see Mormon 8:8) and violence from one end to the other.

Teach Your Children to Honor God

These are just some random thoughts I'm having. I don't claim to know what I'm talking about.

Teach your children to honor God. How do you do that if, like me, your kids are grown? What does "honor God" mean anyway?

I thought about that, and came up with nothing about a week ago. But, today, something did come to mind. We honor God by loving and forgiving each other. We teach our children to honor God by loving and forgiving them, as well as loving and forgiving all who cross our path.

For example, this latest fiasco in the restorationist movement. A blog post written in haste, accusing Denver, casting aspersions on the new scriptures, raising an alarm about a man no one knows - only to find out that the person writing the blog had her facts wrong. What was wrong with her heart? Nothing? Something? That is only for God to judge. My point in bringing her up is that I, also, have reacted in alarm and anger in my life, saying and doing foolish things that I later regretted, things that did not show charity toward my fellow humans.

Matt Crockett wrote a blog post some time ago, in which he essentially commanded Denver, using God's authority (in vain/erroneously, in my opinion) to be our king. This was because Matt did not know that many of us did not need Denver to be a king, and would resent having one, because we were working with God, even if we listened to and believed every word coming out of Denver's mouth (believing every word is probably not wise, as he is a man and prone to error; I simply used that as an example). I reacted to the post uncharitably. I even emailed Denver, complaining about the post. I was so focused on that part of the post that I did not notice the good things in it.

Here is some insight I have gotten recently (quoted from messages I wrote on Skype to a couple of friends):

I think we each saw different parts. Kind of like the blind men and the elephant. I saw that part and was "offended" that he would command Denver to be my king when I was relishing my freedom from kings, thank you very much! I think I feared that if he was listened to I would be brought back into bondage. I've been in bondage to [exhusband], to the LDS Church, to the school system, to the judicial system, and to the medical system (albeit only when I was young, as far as the medical system goes), and there's no way in hell, on earth, or in heaven I wanted someone to push bondage on me again.

You, having no such issues, saw more expansively. You saw several good things in there that I saw later (after you pointed them out, most likely), but my fear of Matt having the power to force me into bondage to Denver ticked me off, and made me protest.

One of my friends replied:

Yet the bondage would have been of your own choice.

I replied:

But I couldn't see that. In fact, the insight I'm sharing here in regards to my own feelings was something I couldn't clearly see then. But now, today, I can clearly see that it was all my own issues. The problem was me, and whether or not Matt was out of line really made no difference - because, as you say, I still had a choice though I feared that choice would be taken away from me.

My point in sharing all this: We honor God by owning our weaknesses, and ceasing to be offended by others. We honor God, and teach our children to do so, by our willingness to own our offenses and not project them onto others, who are only acting as humans will act. We honor God by our willingness to forgive and to love.

Trusting Jesus

This morning, during the sacrament of the Lord's supper, a memory came back to me, as well as insights about it, and I'd like to share it.

I used to be very afraid of heights. When I was a teenager, I was at Lagoon (an amusement park north of Salt Lake City, Utah) with my sister, her husband, and their two children. We were near the ferris wheel and wanted to go to the other side of the park. Above our heads was a ride. It went from one side of the park to the other, and all you did on the ride was travel from one side to the other, high above the park. My brother-in-law and my 2 or 3-year-old niece were going to ride and my sister was going to walk. My brother-in-law was a big, solid guy.

I was torn. I really wanted to ride so I could see the view, but was terribly afraid to do so. I finally decided to follow my brother-in-law. They put the three of us in one of the seats which, to my horror, had no place to put our feet (I'm sure it was to make it easier to get on and off the ride, as it was constantly moving). I really wanted to jump out and say, "No way, I'm not doing that!" But I kept quiet, and it was soon too late to do anything to escape except jump out, which would have hurt a lot.

I put my arms around my brother-in-law's neck and hid my face in his shoulder. Gradually, after I saw that having no footrest didn't make me fall out, I got brave enough to peek out. That led to slowly looking at the scenery until, about halfway through the ride, I was looking at everything. We saw my sister with the baby in the baby-backpack, the other rides, the concession stands, the parking lot.

The ride became enjoyable. I may have still held on to my brother-in-law's arm, but I was no longer terrified. I wasn't even fearful. (That didn't remove my fear of heights, by the way.)

As that experience was brought to my mind today, this thought accompanied it: Christ is my rock. Jesus is my solid foundation. As my brother-in-law was my rock that helped me overcome my fear during that ride, so Jesus is there to help me overcome all fear. Also, the feeling of safety and security that my brother-in-law filled me with returned with the memory of the incident, and I was shown that I can have that same feeling with the Lord. In everything.

My brother-in-law seemed safe and solid and, in that thing he was totally safe. But he is a man. Mortal. Human. He cannot be my salvation, nor my safety in all things. Jesus is safe. Immortal. Divine. And can be my salvation, as well as my safety, in all things.

I think this was a first real step in trusting the Lord, and I praise him for it. He is ever kind, ever beckoning, ever doing all he can to persuade us to trust him, to persuade us that he is the only place of complete safety. No matter what it is we fear, no matter what it is that has hurt us in the past or that threatens us now, he is the only safe place we can be.

I am sure there are other lessons to be learned from that experience, lessons that would bring me closer to Jesus Christ, my Lord.

In any case, I hope this recollection helps someone who reads this. I hope it helps you draw closer to the Lord, who loves you.
 

 

A Purpose of Trials and Sacrifices

These are some thoughts I had this morning. That doesn't mean I really know what I'm talking about. I do think, though, that this conclusion was a result of pondering about "Goliaths" evaporating once we learn to choose faith in regards to them.

We are here to learn faith in Christ.

As we learn a little faith, he gives us a little more - to push our faith forward.

The trials we have and the sacrifices he asks, including the huge sacrifice at the supposed end is just another step in learning faith and in learning to trust him.

It is for our benefit, so that -eventually- we have the faith to be self-existent. Faith to attain to the resurrection of the dead (in other words, not dependent upon a God to resurrect us - but, instead, we can resurrect those who depend upon us).

On Trials and Challenges - part 2

The last post was so dang long that I didn't want to make it longer.

Continuing the idea, though, when the car began to act up, it was difficult to continue believing (not that I was that good at it in the first place - I had simply agreed to do what God had suggested.)

 I was facing my troubles and trials, as I said at the beginning of the last post. It was so painful to come face to face with so many things I could not control and/or feared. This morning, I was lead to read a few pages in The Second Comforter.

Pages 74-75:

How we perceive our challenges determines how we meet them. If we see God as the overriding influence in life's challenges, then we can trust God to help us through them. ... the dilemma is never merely physical. It is always a battle between faith and skepticism. Do you see it as a fight between your own willingness to trust God to deliver you ...?  Does God care about your life's dilemmas? Will He help deliver you from your 'Goliaths?' Do you trust Him? Do you believe in Him? Do you believe He is interested and involved in your life? Will you accept the proof of His involvement as His word to you? Do you feel His proofs are not sufficient or substantial enough to have faith in them?

Faith in a distant and unconcerned God may satisfy some .... But that is not the God Nephi (or David) believed in. In Nephi's example we find a personal God involved in everyday life. We find a God who will give a challenge to us, and then walk beside us to see we succeed. Nephi is trying to teach us this is the way God operates in all of our lives. He is not distant. He is a part of each of our daily lives. We can ignore Him, or acknowledge Him. But whether we accept or reject His involvement, Nephi's view is that He is present and concerned.

If you want to have an audience with God, you must first be willing to see God as someone who does have personal, direct and onging involvement with each of our lives. You must accept Him as someone who cares enough about you that He will help you accomplish His commandments. You must be willing to accept the forms of communication He uses to facilitate this.

This example of Nephi's is not limited to retrieving a book from a hostile cousin. It should apply to any of life's challenges. ... That is how you need to see the challenges you have. No Goliath in your life will destroy you. Rather, God will destroy the Goliaths for you.

In the end, Goliaths are merely opportunities for you to demonstrate your faith. They will be swept away when they no longer serve any purpose. They are there only temporarily to provide you with an opportunity to demonstrate faith.

As I thought on this, pondered on it, it seemed to me that what I was seeing were a) my obstacles (see the questions in the first quoted paragraph) and b) that all of these troubles would evaporate once I had learned to have faith in God. They are only there to teach me to trust God. Once I learn that, they will cease to exist.

That trust, that unconditional trust is what I crave. It is what I am attempting to grasp and incorporate into my being. I hope God is truly long-suffering and patient because it looks, to me, like an exceedingly long road before I can answer any of the questions in the affirmative, let alone have enough trust and faith in him to allow my present tribulations and challenges to evaporate.

On Trials and Challenges

 Challenges

So, I had a challenge that broke me, having to do with my car which I desperately need (it still runs, but has me concerned that it may stop running). It was the proverbial straw.

I was sitting at the computer a few nights ago, reading forums and skype, when I felt the Lord telling me to come talk to him. I procrastinated until too close to bedtime to say much before I slept. But I did talk to him the next morning, extensively.

Last night, I got the same "feeling" and got off the computer much earlier.

(As a side note, recently (before the experience(s) I am currently relating), I prayed all night. I began around 10 or 11 p.m. At one point, said I had to sleep, but felt compelled to continue. When I noticed light coming through the blinds, I checked the time. It was just after 6 a.m. It was difficult to believe that much time had passed.)

The reason I procrastinated talking to him was because I didn't want to face what was tormenting me. I felt I would totally break with reality if I had to look at everything all at once, and I knew that's what I would be doing if I talked to him.

 The car was and is only one of many issues that have been tormenting me. It's easier not to break when you pretend nothing is there.

I looked it all square in the face as I talked to him. I admitted that I did not know how to fix any of it. Like the proverbial child who doesn't know and knows that he doesn't know. That was me.

Do This

A few months ago, I dabbled with the idea of going back to college. Just for fun. Well, I began the process. Somewhere along the line I decided I ought to go for a bachelors degree (I already have an associates degree).

Also, somewhere along the line, I talked to God about it. He told me he wanted me to go. He didn't care what classes I took; he simply wanted me to go and take what I really wanted to take. I wasn't sure what to make of it.

Then I read some words on this post that went into my mind - as if it possibly applied to me. The author was quoting someone else.

Everyone faces the identical challenge.  It seems different only because of our individual strengths and weaknesses.  The challenge is adapted to our own personality, capacity and life's history. Therefore, when you are asked to overcome something, it will fit in the framework of your life.

All are asked to make a sacrifice that shows they will not withhold anything from the Lord.  It will come to each person based on what they value and would regret to their core surrendering.  Whatever that is, you will be asked by the Lord to give it to Him.  You must decide to do that when asked.

All are asked to do something that they view as wrong, evil or inappropriate and will seem to be inconsistent with the Lord's mercy, righteousness and perfection.  The request will unmistakably come from Him.  You cannot evade the request because you doubt He is asking.  You will clearly know it is Him who asks, and that to all your understanding it will be wrong to do.  You must do it anyway.

All are asked to take a step in faith beyond where they are at the time.  Trust in Him, and only Him, as you take that step.  You will be certain that if it were something you were undertaking on your own, it could not be accomplished.  But because you are doing as He has asked, you know you will have the strength or support to do as He bids.

I could not see how it could fit what the Lord had asked me (college). I went through the points with God to see what was really being said:

First: “The challenge is adapted to our own personality, capacity and life's history. Therefore, when you are asked to overcome something, it will fit in the framework of your life.”

Second: “You will not withhold anything from the Lord. It is something you will regret to your core surrendering.” I know of nothing that would fit this. I have lost so much in the last 20-30 years, that anything else I lose would probably freak me out or give me a nervous breakdown, but I cannot see how I could not stop it from happening.

Third: “Whatever that is, you will be asked by the Lord to give it to Him. You must decide to do that when asked.”

Fourth: “All are asked to do something that they view as wrong, evil or inappropriate and will seem to be inconsistent with the Lord's mercy, righteousness and perfection.”

Fifth: “The request will unmistakably come from Him. You cannot evade the request because you doubt He is asking.”

And, sixth: “All are asked to take a step in faith beyond where they are at the time.  Trust in Him, and only Him, as you take that step. You will be certain that if it were something you were undertaking on your own, it could not be accomplished.”

1st: Well, it is certainly adapted to my personality, capacity, and life's history.

2nd, I've already commented on.

3rd: He did ask and I did say yes and am in the process of doing that.

4th: Here, I balked. "Lord, you know this is not evil or bad or wrong. It isn't against any scriptural law that I know of."

"Look at it closely," he said, "and tell me what you think of you doing this."

I looked at it, and I said, "Of course, it's wrong for me to go to college. Of course, it's a sin for me to pursue subjects that I have wanted to learn from my core since I was a child, because I'm not supposed to have what I want. I'm not supposed to do what I love. It's a sin - but for me, not for anyone else."

And as I kept attempting to explain, I saw that I was going in a frustrated circle. He was right. My core self believes it is the height of evil for me to do anything I would like, anything that would bring me joy and fulfillment. It's okay for others to pursue lives and careers that speak to their souls, but not for me.

We finally settled on agreeing to disagree because I was confusing myself.

5th: Even though it was quiet, even though it was simple, I was absolutely sure I was talking to the Lord.

6th: Absolutely, I could not accomplish this on my own. Not only financially (tuition, fees, books, rent and other bills, and so on), but the thing, itself. As I faced the thing square on, I saw insecurities about failing.

I finally saw that what I was supposed to do is simply give it my best, as I enjoyed it. Enjoy the journey. ("Who is this, really? God is supposed to make us do all sorts of painful sacrifices. He's supposed to make us miserable, even unto death, because that's what this life is for: suffering and sacrifice and pain.")

Knowing who the Lord Really Is

So, I was talking to him about this. Talking about the sacrifices, the ones that hurt, the ones that Brother Snuffer and others talk about.

He said to me, "I'm not going to do that to you yet. First, you have to know me enough to trust me. After you know me, then I can ask you to do other things. For now, we are working on you knowing who I really am and trusting me."

The understanding that accompanied that was seeing that I did not know his personality. I did not know him as a friend or a father. This needed to come first. And, as I recall, this message that I needed to learn to trust him, needed to learn to see and feel and believe his love for me came after the thing I wrote below.

#

That's the end of the post. However, below, I'm going to relate our conversation about point 4 in more detail for those who may be interested (I wrote it down soon afterward and this is a quote from what I wrote). Feel absolutely free to ignore it. [Brackets are my current insertions.]

The bit about God wanting you to do something "wrong" - well, I can't believe it but every time I don't, I'm immediately faced with my own deep conviction that - for me - it is wrong, it is a huge sin.

And I wondered why God would choose such a strange sacrifice for me. And I thought maybe God was using it to cause me to further trust him for food and such. And to trust him in general. And it was brought to my mind the time I did testing at workforce (in St. George - when my kids were ages 5/6, 8 & 10). the lady who told me my test results apologized that the IQ test only went to 126. I had surpassed that. They couldn't measure what it really was (one I'd taken a few years earlier averaged me at 144 - with the "logic" aspect being something like 168). [Note: I could have inflated that. It could have been 142 and 162 or 164.] She had noticed that I had finished the sections before others in the room (which would add points). She told me I could be anything, even a medical doctor. That experience is what came to my mind as I doubted my ability to take the languages. And I wondered why God would encourage me in such a secular thing. [The classes I signed up for are Chinese, French, and Spanish, as far as languages go.]

Isn't my job here to suffer, be miserable, never get what I really want? That's about the time the thought of "In contraries is truth made manifest" [came].

I mean, if I['m] going to go through the crap and emerge on the other side safe and whole, then there's got to be the possibility that the other side exists, right?

And, it's such a personal journey.

But I find myself suspicious. "Are you sure this is God? The devil is the one who tells us to do things we like," etc - etc.

So, you believe the devil gives you good things and I give you bad? was the gist of the reply.

And I have to admit that the answer is yes. I have learned exactly that. God gives homelessness, fear, hunger, poverty, pain, persecution, blocks any chance of having a creative outlet or doing what one loves.

It is the devil who says you should follow your dreams and desires, pursue your interests, who offers to you to never go hungry and so forth. (Not that he always delivers.)

Isn't that backwards, the "voice" [in my mind -not actually audible words] asks gently. Why would God/I give you talents and abilities only to have you sacrifice them?

Because you're a God who requires sacrifice of everything we like, of everything that makes us comfortable (food, clothing, house, safety, etc.).

True, but haven't you been doing that all along? Haven't you been suffering your whole life? Don't you think it's finally time you rested from that and learned what your soul craves (French, for example), and finally opened up to letting me provide abundantly for you - so much so that you can help others?

Me: This is really the devil I'm talking to, isn't it? Only the devil would pretend to offer me food ... [etc.].

So, you think that if you ask me bread, I'll give you a stone?

No, I think that when I have asked you for bread in the past, you have given me poison. When I've asked for a fish, you've given me worse than a fiery, poisonous serpent.

It isn't what I'd want to say to a God, but I must be honest in my perception of you.

Then why follow me? Why seek me out?

Because it's in my soul to do so. It is in my nature to  [pause] - oh.

(Smiles) [Meaning he smiled]

In my soul to seek you. In my soul to learn languages. In my soul to heal. In my soul to live with the earth, in nature, in "my" home.

I'm confused now.

You were always confused, my dear. How about you do an experiment? (I love experiments - behavioral ones, especially ...)

Just for this school year, you trust me. Maybe for two school years and one summer. You do what I say, which is to do this great "sin" of going after your dream of being a linguist - Let go and go for it.

Just for these next two years, assume (the real meaning, not the ass meaning) that I'm there for you, that I will provide for you and protect you. Sins, all, in your estimation. Do that for me, okay? (okay?)

That's a strange sacrifice you're asking of me.

It's a strange set of beliefs you carry.

Me, again: Okay. It makes no sense to me why you should ask me to do this "sin" which is only a sin to/for me. This whole thing is weird - But, okay, for you I'll do it.

[Turning attention heavenward] And, dear God, the Real God of heaven and earth, if I've been talking to the devil this whole time, please step in. I don't want to be happy if you want me miserable. I don't want to be well-nourished and in a home/land that nourishe[s] both  body and soul if you want me to be hungry, under-nourished, and either homeless or living away from nature.

God: Sigh

. . . 

So there you have it. I'm breaking out of a cycle - A cycle of misery and woe and hunger and homelessness and attracting predators and not learning/doing what is in my soul to do.

My "sacrifice" is to let God pull me out of hell and protect me and let me (make the way for me to) do what is in my soul to do.

What will happen? I'm sure I do not know. If the past indicates the future, I'll give up. I'll pull out. I'll continue the cycle of lack and misery.

The reason I post this personal stuff is because there may be another "loser" out there whose life seems to have given them the same message. Perhaps God wants to pull you out of misery if you could only learn to trust him.

If there is someone like that who reads this, I hope for your sake that I succeed - so that you can see that you, also, can succeed.

Helaman 3:27-30

Thus we may see that the Lord is merciful unto all who will, in the sincerity of their hearts, call upon his holy name. Yea, thus we see that the gate of heaven is open unto all, even to those who will believe on the name of Jesus Christ, who is the Son of God. Yea, we see that whosoever will may lay hold upon the word of God, which is quick and powerful, which shall divide asunder all the cunning and the snares and the wiles of the devil, and lead the man of Christ in a strait and narrow course across that everlasting gulf of misery which is prepared to engulf the wicked— And land their souls, yea, their immortal souls, at the right hand of God in the kingdom of heaven, to sit down with Abraham, and Isaac, and with Jacob, and with all our holy fathers, to go no more out.

Anyone can lay hold on the word of God, not just members of a certain sect (LDS, FLDS, RLDS, JW, SDA, etc.).

The word of God is quick and powerful.

The word of God cuts to bits all the tricks, lies, deceits, traps, and so forth that the devil throws out.

The word of God leads the (hu)man who follows Christ in a strait and narrow course. Rather like a guide who leads people through a forest, because he knows the right trails to follow.

Across that everlasting gulf of misery which is prepared to engulf the wicked. This shows my bias towards mortality, but I look at this and see that this mortality touches everlasting on the one side and everlasting on the other. It, being in time, is in the middle.

And is it not a place where the most wicked dwell? Does it not engulf the wicked? Are we not swallowed up in the cares of the world, in perversions, greed, fear, lust for power and money, lust for bodies to play with, the need to survive, and so forth? Are we not all wicked to some degree or other?

To land with the Gods (why does this remind me of fishing? He landed the fish).

To go no more out. What? So, if God makes lots of eternal rounds in an effort to save his children, does this mean that if we follow Christ and don't veer off the path, we don't have to come back to another round? We can be with the Gods? We can be on that upper rung of Jacob's ladder? We don't have to come down into a mortal hell ever again? Sounds enticing to me.

Let's do it. Let's follow Christ and let him lead us safely out of this vale of tears and pain. Let us not allow the cares of this world, the fears of this world, the lusts of this world to distract us from our task of escaping this stuff.

When God Asks for the Ultimate Sacrifice

Job. Abraham. Others. God either put into their lives something they greatly feared, or asked them to do something that - I believe - they greatly feared.

One of the parts on the path to God is that He will ask you to do something you do not want. It appears that it is something that is fearful to you. Abraham was going to be offered up as a human sacrifice. It is only natural that he should fear not only having such a thing done to him, but having it done to his beloved son. He had apparently already lost one son when Sarah kicked out the boy and his mother. He may have been fearful of losing his other son. Job plainly says that the thing he greatly feared had come upon him.

A friend and I were talking about Abraham's sacrifice. She pointed out that God wants us to face our fears and overcome them. That is the point of asking us to do the one thing we most don't want to do.

It is not so we can take a stand against God and say, "No. I'm going to be an adult here, and I will not do what you ask." (There is a thought process going around that Abraham lost his exaltation because he obeyed the command to offer up Isaac. Such a notion contradicts scripture.)

Neither is it to feed God's pride, or to show us and Him that we will bend to Him at all costs (though bending to Him at all costs is part of the process).

It is God helping us to over come all fear, all hesitation: Fear of what others will think about us or do to us. Fear of losing everything. Fear that your only son will not only be killed, but will be killed as a sacrifice.

Do we trust God? Do we trust that what He asks us to do is for our own benefit? Truly? Deep inside? Does God love us? Is He selfless in that love? Can He be trusted with all that we are, have, and believe?

It is a process of learning to trust God completely. When He asks for that one thing that we fear most, that one thing that we are most reluctant to put upon the altar, we are learning several things:

God always comes first. Not us. Not our families. Not our religion. Not our money nor our job. Not our reputation.
We learn to overcome all fear. After that experience, we fear nothing.
We learn to be selfless. Those who become eligible to be as God, must be as selfless as He is.

I'm sure there are many other things to be learned from this, however, this is all I have right now. Isn't scripture study incredibly interesting? Isn't there so much to learn and gain from looking deeply into what is there, and asking God to open up to us what we do not know?

Random Thoughts on Covenants and Birth

This morning, as I was praying and trying to sort out my mind in an effort to stop following darkness (the sins are sins of thought), rather randomly Denver Snuffer's comments in his latest (temple) fireside came to my mind in conjunction with my first baby.

First, this is what he said (1:15:24-1:16:07): "And I can tell you that covenants traditionally involve cutting - And covenants in the Old Testament involve the shedding of blood - And covenants with our Lord at some point, in some contexts, with some reaches, require that we suffer."

[sidenote: In pioneer times, the marks cut into a person's clothing were not sewn on.]

He was in the midst of speaking of his own suffering, of operations performed that involved the flesh being cut, as well as blood being shed.

When I was pregnant for the tirst time, I decided this was my "tithing child". This was the child I would dedicate to the Lord, according to the law of sacrifice in the Old Testament (as I understand it).

According to the Bible:

(As it is written in the law of the Lord, Every male that openeth the womb shall be called holy to the Lord
(New Testament | Luke 2:23)

 My child ended up being female. In fact, some months before she was born, she emphatically told me, "Don't call me a boy!" In my mind and heart, though, I did not waver in devoting her to the Lord. I'm sure I broke some ancient Jewish law because I was female and I was offering up my child as a covenant to God, and the child ended up being female. I didn't even know there would be a "God's part" to this gift, to this covenant. As far as I know, there is none.

She was a home birth-turned-c-section. Because I did not feel safe where I was laboring (for reasons I won't go into here), my body would not let her out, so we went to the hospital after many hours. She was breech. Had the medical community not been fearful (or is that "terrified") of delivering a breech naturally, she would have been born vaginally, because as soon as we got to the hospital my body started pushing her out.

In any case, she was a c-section. A cesarean. That means they cut open my belly. They sliced open my skin, then my muscles, and then my uterus, then they pulled her out through the cuts. I was awake for this but did not have to watch it, thank goodness.

My firstborn, offered as a "living sacrifice" to God, was offered via the cutting of the person who gave the gift. (The child, herself, seemed to have no problem with this. They showed her to me right after they pulled her out. She was checking things out, looking at this new place she was in to see what it was like. We had an incredible link from the beginning, which diminished the more she let go of the spiritual world, the more she became incorporated into this world.)

It involved cutting. It involved hellish pain, the likes of which I had never experienced before (physically), and never have since (I gave birth vaginally twice after, with a painkiller for about an hour for my middle child, no painkiller for the last child). It involved hellish pain after, because I did not want to bother the nurses and waited too long to ask for a painkiller after I was in my room. By the time I was hurting, it was the shift change and they could not give me a painkiller until they were through giving reports to the new shift. By then, I was in agony again, a fiery agony this time.

I almost did not have my next baby. I believed to my core that God hated women, or that He had a particular grudge against me, personally. The lie that a woman forgets the pain and "it is all worth it" came up in my face at least once by a well-meaning woman who had obviously experienced this forgetting. Even now, I have not forgotten that hell. But I still dedicated the child to God.

And I decided that I needed to give God a chance to prove that He did not hate me, that He did not hate women, and I let myself get pregnant again to see what He would do, if anything. (This took a great deal of courage. Also, I had gathered my children around me when I was about to be married and told them to prepare to be born, so I felt a commitment to have these children. Three - two girls and a boy - had gathered close to me, and one boy was farther off, who I have not had yet. Though God gave Isaac to Sarah at 99 years old, I do not know if God will give such a gift to this son and myself. I have nearly 45 years to see, though. *smilie*)

It was illegal in my state for a midwife to attend a post-cesarean mother, hence home birth was out of the question (I had not heard of freebirth at the time). I ended up going to Utah. Salt Lake City, actually, where I ended up with the most incredible doctor (Dr. Pease) and a very good hospital (Holy Cross Hospital between North and South Temple and between 10th and 11th East). There was no question in my mind that I'd have a vaginal birth. The cut I'd had was the kind that allows a "trial" labor, but I innocently ignored the word "try".

I did not know I was "supposed" to rip apart. I had no clue that I was "supposed" to explode inside. Neither the woman who pulled out my oldest daughter nor Dr. Pease gave me a reason to fear. The second labor was less than three hours from start to finish. Had someone been there who would have told me that my feelings of "I can't do this," was a sign that the baby was about ready to be pushed into the world and to hang in there at least 15 more minutes, I would not have asked for a painkiller, and the pushing stage would have been 1/2 an hour instead of one hour. (They warned me that the painkiller might not take effect until after the baby had been born, but I did not recognize that as a statement that the baby was about to be born.)

I was also surprised at the rest between contractions at the beginning. My last experience had been one long pain that was somewhat tolerable at the beginning turning into something so bad long before the 13 hours were over that it was more than I could endure. (I was very uncomfortable with how this was worded before. It was true, but it "felt" like it was offensive or uncomfortable to someone.)

I recognized that God did His part very well in the second birth, considering my total lack of faith and considering my very dark thoughts about Him. In fact, right after second daughter was born, I told a nurse I wanted to have another baby, I wanted to labor and birth again. She discouraged that idea. lol

Actually, God was incredibly loving and patient to not punish me for my honest beliefs about Him. Any human I know personally would have been swift to punish such insubordination, such heresy, such blasphemy as I thought and believed in my heart of hearts.

So, now, as I struggle with losing battles against darkness and wondering if it is even worth trying to fight for control of my own thoughts, my mind turns to this experience and I wonder what, if anything, it all means. I wonder if it was a covenant, - and if it was, was the covenant sealed by the shedding of my blood and by my incredible suffering. And if  so, what was God's part in it. What was it He was supposed to give?

Thoughts on Storing Food

First - Where is the revelation where God commands us to store food?

I wonder if it would have been better to learn how to trust God for my supply, instead of putting away food.

What if food storage subverts the work of God as He tries to teach us to rely on Himinstead of the arm of flesh (even if it is our own arm)?

We (my family and I) are living off our food storage. The oil is nearly gone. Depending on how many sweets we make, the sugar could last several months to a year (we don't usually use it very quickly). The salt will last forever (we don't use much of that, either). Our oils are olive oil and grapeseed oil. Our sugar is sucanat (brown) and dried cane juice (white, but not as white as refined cane sugar). To replace any of those items with similar items is more than we can afford right now. We'd have to “downsize” to the lowest quality available (or go without).

But this post isn't to draw attention to us, nor to make anyone feel sorry for us. God is taking care of us. We aren't starving. I'm just wondering if we would have, perhaps, been better off learning to trust God for our food supply instead of our own ability to hoard, even if collecting the food entailed sacrifice (which it did at times).

Second - The fruits of storing food.

What are they? You know the most prolific fruit I see? Fear and violence.

So many people (not all - and I know many because of my interaction with the internet) are stockpiling weapons to defend their food storage. They speak of how they plan to kill anyone who tries to take their food by force. They speak of how they will make someone who asks for food labor in the most menial, demeaning ways to earn the right to survive. You know, s/he didn't prepare when the time was right. Now the time of preparation is past. Even though I didn't agree with the violent tendencies, it seem “normal” to me. But, now . . .

What about King Benjamin's sermon? What about not judging the beggar? What about freely giving to him/her? What about the fact that his/her death is upon your head if they perish because you withheld food?

“Which of my children should die that you might live?” Catchy comeback for those who assume they can just come to your house and get some food when times get bad, because they didn't store away food. (I liked the comeback when I first heard it. I thought I could use it if I ever came across that particular situation.)

But this doesn't sound like the fruits of the Spirit on either side - Not on the side of the one assuming they have a right to take, nor on the side of the one who assumes that sharing means automatic death for a family member.

I see food storage preventing faith that God will provide.

I see food storage causing otherwise good people to desire to kill their fellowmen.

I see food storage causing selfishness, pride, and greed.

I see food storage causing envy, covetousness, and anger.

This is a new view for me. A new paradigm. An unexpected turn of thought.

What if we are supposed to rely on God and God only, for our support?

The rich man who hoarded his grain was only being a good steward. He was making sure he had his long term supply of food - And God called him a fool.

Jesus said (in the Bible) that we shouldn't worry about how or if we are fed and clothed. He seemed to be talking to everyone, the 12 apostles as well as the general congregation. Jesus said the same thing to another group (in the Book of Mormon), but it was to 12 disciples and didn't seem to be directed to the multitude in general. I don't know if that means something or not.

A group of people in the Book of Mormon got together a 7 year supply -

But -

1) They did it together

2) There was an immediate threat they were responding to.

The Pharaoh in the Old Testament had a warning dream. God's seer interpreted it. Again, there was a specific threat. God gave a specific revelation in relation to it.

What if the people in Pharaoh's time had been righteous? What if they were in the habit of trusting God for their supply? Would there have been a need for them to eventually sell their souls to the Pharaoh? Would the dream have been necessary? Joseph certainly would not have been in prison because a wanton woman would not have been among the people (neither would slavery had been among them). Did God provide the dream because the people, like us, lacked the faith for God to provide for them day by day and minute by minute? Like the ravens. Like manna. Like clothes never wearing out (and that was among a rebellious people).

And the Israelites the dream was intended to save? How righteous were they? Many of them wanted to kill their brother. Instead, they threw him in a pit and sold him as a slave, putting blood on his clothes so the lie they told their father would seem more realistic. Two of them massacred a great many young men in a certain town. One slept with his father's wife. This doesn't sound like people who would be able to draw down the power of heaven when a famine showed up (and perhaps the famine was to humble them).

For us today, what happens when the food runs out? When there are no stores to go to? No money even if there were stores? No gardens because there is no safety, no unpoisoned land, no good water? Will we be fed by ravens? Will manna come from heaven? What if we have killed to protect our food supply? Is God bound to save our lives after we have done that? Will He still send ravens or manna or water from a rock to a murderous people?

I have not seen even one revelation from God for our time, commanding us to have a food supply (yet we think there was one). I have not seen such a revelation telling us to rely on it for our lives.

A dream by an unknown person (attributed to John Taylor, I believe, but the truth is that there is no name attached though there is a space for the name once the journal writer found out who had it). What credence should we give to that? The same as we give to the myriad of other rumors of thus and so general authority had a dream or a prophecy, but never bothered to deliver the message over the pulpit, pointing out that God had given it to him to warn the people?

“Thus saith the Lord, it is meet that my people gather together food and other supplies to sustain them for xxxx years, And this is a standing law unto them forever (or at least until I come). Amen.”

Where is it? If God said it and it is scripture for our day, it should be in the Doctrine and Covenants. I cannot find it there.

And if it isa commandment from God (but someone forgot to canonize it), why are the fruits

fear

greed

anger

envy

violence

murder

slavery?

If it was from God, wouldn't the fruits be

faith

charity

peace

generosity

freedom?

As one who has been to the spirit world, I can tell you that to kill for fear of dying from hunger makes no sense. If you do that, your death when it comes will not be pleasant for you. As one who has experienced serious hunger, I assure you that one does adjust to hunger. For myself, the pain became my friend. I didn't want it to leave. Scary thought, huh?

I'm a Mormon

Inspired by this and this and this post, I decided to add my own testimony of assorted things.

I'm a Mormon. I'm a Mormon who has a brother who began to research church history when I was about eleven years old. Pretty much all of our ancestors, except for the Swedish line, came from Nauvoo. Some of the things my brother told me about church history were far from faith-promoting. As a young adult, I had several friends who began to learn about the history we don't hear at church; they also began “searching for the mysteries”. All of these (my friends and my brother) left the church. I didn't. I was pretty good at “putting [things] on the shelf” and, besides that, I was acutely aware that the biggest mystery in my life was to know myself and overcome the sins that so easily beset me. I had no desire for any deeper mystery (and wasn't even sure that the mysteries my friends were seeking were the mysteries the scriptures were talking about).

I also read many “anti-Mormon” books. (It has been over thirty years since I've read them, so I don't remember a whole lot of specific examples from them.) I noticed several things about the ones I read:

First, there were a lot of “must have beens” thrown in. Sometimes it was a real stretch of logic to come to those conclusions. I saw no reason why something “must have been” from the evidence given. I could think of other “could have beens”.

Second, the books contradicted themselves. One example that I can think of right now is the book written by one of Brigham Young's wives. He lusted after her, she said. He was really wanting her sexually, the dirty old man. But, lo and behold, many pages later we find out that he married her. And her chief complaint was that he never (apparently not even once) had sex with her. Hm. So which accusation is true? If he lusted after her so much, wouldn't her complaint be that she couldn't make him stay away from her? Her other chief complaint was that he wouldn't give her money. She expected him to support her. In fact, it appeared that the only reason she married him was for money and prestige. In any case, she was bummed that he only gave her a house she could use for a rooming house to bring in her own money. Actually, that way, she wouldn't have to be dependent on him, begging for money – but that is a perception that was not appreciated until much later in American history.

Third, harmless things were depicted as horrendously evil. Joseph Smith was a money-digger. That means he dug for gold and such. Oooh, spawn of the devil, indeed! So, what does that make all of those people who followed the gold into California and Alaska? What does that make people in the past and present who mine for gold, silver, copper, diamonds, and so forth? And he believed in superstitious things. You know, things that we are far too “superior” to believe in today. Incredible, isn't it? He had faith in things unseen, like a child does until it “knows better”. I doubt angels and Gods could have appeared to someone too “sophisticated” and “advanced” to believe it possible.

Fourth, truths were depicted as lies straight from hell. For example, the doctrine that humans can, through repentance and the grace of God, eventually become gods, themselves. Yes, the devil told Eve that if she ate the fruit that she would become like the Gods, in that she would know good from evil. The devil was right; he just neglected to tell her that it was through excruciating pain that she would learn the difference. But, seriously, if God tells a truth, who was Joseph, and who is the church, to change the truth into a lie to make it palatable to the world at large?

Fifth, there were some outright lies. The woman who stated some things were never taught (like Jesus was never mentioned when she went to primary), ever. But, of course, she fell into the category of contradicting herself. She knew exactly what the “Mormon” church taught every Sunday even though she admitted in another part of the book that she rarely went. It reminds me of the woman I met on my mission who told me how evil the Book of Mormon was. When I asked her if she had ever read it, the answer was no. She'd never read such an evil book and she never intended to read it. Strange how she would know so much more than me about a book she had never read, but that I had read several times.

The books, I noticed, would suck people in on an emotional level. Once that happened, you'd be “good and angry” so that the inconsistencies and idiocies in the book would go unnoticed by your rational mind.

On my mission, my foundation got knocked out from under me, and I realized it had been based on being surrounded by an LDS environment. In Michigan, that environment was not there. So, my base of faith began to be built up again, being based on something other than environment.

Recently, I came across a book called, “Passing the Heavenly Gift”. I thought I could handle it, in light of my brother, friends, and the books I'd read. There were many parts of the book I didn't like. There were a couple of experiences I read that I could have gone my whole life without knowing, and I would have been fine and dandy about it. But the book lacked the anti-Mormon qualities. I don't recall any “must have beens”. I saw no contradictions. Things one might have considered “horrendously evil” were explained. Truths were depicted as true. There was nothing that I could see was a lie. And the best thing was that I could take Brigham Young off the shelf. I'm not any more impressed with him than I have been since I was 11 or 12, but I can accept him as a “legal” or bona fide leader now. He is no longer an enigma to me.

Oh, I've got to mention this: I recognized immediately that I am one of the “proud descendents of Nauvoo” and the label didn't bother me one whit. I am what I am. I was glad to wake up. I was glad to see things in a better light, even if it showed me that my ancestors were not quite as worthy to be worshipped as I had been taught. That doesn't diminish their suffering. It doesn't diminish their humanness. I don't think them worthy of anger or resentment. I'm not so sure I would have done any better if I had been in their shoes.

I like the original plan of letting every member of the LDS church believe the way they understand the gospel to be, instead of trying to force each member into a unified box, or having a secret committee like the Strengthening the Members Committee. I like the idea of letting my son have ear plugs if he wants them. I like the idea of a variety of clothing on the men each Sunday. Some men look terrific with beards and/or a mustache. I like the idea of being able to meet with friends to discus the gospel without an “authorized priesthood leader” around to make sure we aren't going “apostate”. I like the idea of seeing someone at church with a tattoo and admiring the beauty if it is an artistic drawing. I like the idea of accepting each other as children of God when we don't fit some preconceived and arbitrary mold. I have known demons who “dressed the dress” and appeared to “walk the walk” and “talk the talk”. I have known angels who not only didn't “look the part” but who were not members of my religion (or were not active members of it). (For the curious, I am speaking of mortals, not actual unembodied demons nor of angels from the presence of God.)

I love my God. I love my Savior. Jesus Christ has rescued me from hell. When He has sent true messengers, He has told me they were His if I asked. He has been opening my mind to the fact that we are all on equal ground, that not one person is better than another. True messengers are not to be worshipped nor idolized nor feared nor strictly obeyed. The message is to be listened to, heeded and probably strictly obeyed, but only after God has let us know it is a true message. Sometimes that message is not comfortable. Sometimes it tells us our thinking has been all wrong. But the honor and the glory go to the Man who has sent the message, not the one who has delivered it.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is Jesus' church. It was restored through a bona fide prophet of God who was not only imperfect, but never made a pretense of perfection.

The leaders the church have now are bona fide leaders. They are there through our common consent. They are thus eligible for inspiration and revelation when it comes to guiding the church. Like Joseph Smith, they are imperfect, and should not make a pretense of perfection. If they have given anyone the idea that they are perfect and that every action they have and every word they speak is as if God, Himself, has spoken and acted I would think they would feel sorrow for that worship of men.

Jesus has not deserted this church. As far as I know, He has not deserted any soul who lives upon the face of this earth. He speaks to anyone who will listen, no matter what religion they espouse.